| IRC log started Thu Aug 11 19:55:45 2005 |
| -:- Topic (#pashdown): changed by pashdown: Live from the Gallivan Center its Thursday Night Chat |
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| pashdown | Hello Evan |
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| evan | hi pete |
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| pashdown | Hello all |
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| EricB | Hey Pete |
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| EricB | Who's at the concert tonight Pete? |
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| pashdown | David Grisman Quartet |
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| kevin | if only I didn't live in BFE |
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| pashdown | Someone asking me about XMission right now |
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| kevin | "here, have a sticker" |
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| kevin | "in fact, have twenty" |
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| EricB | I have one of the round Xmission clings still |
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| kevin | mine's just below my pashdown sticker |
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| EricB | So what's the lowdown on the FCC making DSL an information service? |
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| pashdown | It only applies to telcos leasing copper to DSL companies |
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| pashdown | Earthlink does a lot of that. XMission doesn't do any. |
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| pashdown | Although I don't entirely agree with the premise. If there was public financing of a network, then it is partially owned by the public. |
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| EricB | So do you think this will just keep prices the same since the Bells will control more over who get's DSL? |
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| pashdown | I don't think it will change much with our relationship with Qwest. |
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| pashdown | I don't know about how Covad and other copper leasers will survive if the Bells decide to have no mercy. |
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| kevin | I heard they have to share the copper wire, but not their equipment |
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| EricB | So really this is the Feds handing over yet another monopoly where there will most likely be little to no progress in deploying DSL |
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| kevin | so no wholesale arrangements, like mcleod etc |
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| pashdown | I wouldn't be that draconian about it. |
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| pashdown | I think they've made money off the current situation and that is the biggest motivator. |
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| pashdown | I only wish the cable companies would get a sniff of that same money. |
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| EricB | Well we did see Qwest donate several million to the 2002 Olympics, the propose a rate hike the next week |
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| pashdown | One sec |
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| EricB | Sorry, "then propose" |
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| * kevin/#pashdown follows protocol |
| kevin | ? |
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| pashdown | Go ahead Kevin |
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| kevin | socialized medicine? |
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| kevin | a long-term goal? |
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| kevin | you know, like the rest of the industrialized world |
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| pashdown | Two approaches that I think will help |
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| pashdown | First is setting up incentives for businesses to create savings accounts similar to HSA's where they can cover employees out of pocket. |
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| pashdown | Second is encouraging efficiencies through technology in healthcare itself. |
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| pashdown | My wife and I were talking about billing issues tonight with a doctor that was off the plan. |
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| kevin | how to ensure those efficiencies aren't just pocketed? |
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| pashdown | They probably would have saved a lot of money and time if they had our email addresses. |
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| pashdown | Its a good question Kevin. I don't think doctors should be forced into regulation on their prices. |
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| EricB | ? |
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| pashdown | I don't think full on socialized medicine will ever fly in America |
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| kevin | Although some doctors may be overpaid, I feel the major problem is with the for-profit corporate machine and their ever-increasing profit |
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| pashdown | The for-profit healthcare flies in the face of the Hypocratic oath. |
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| pashdown | The doctors that I've talked to recognize the problem and don't really like it. |
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| pashdown | Go ahead EricB |
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| EricB | malpractice insurance keeps the prices high, what about a cap on malpractice lawsuits? |
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| pashdown | I'm not sure if that is entirely true. |
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| kevin | . |
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| pashdown | There have been caps on malpractice in California and its had little effect on insurance premiums for doctors' malpractice insurance. |
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| pashdown | Go ahead Kevin |
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| kevin | wrt malpractice, it sure seems like a diversionary tactic. malpractice costs are rising, but such a tiny fraction of the medical cost issue |
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| gthornock | . |
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| pashdown | One person who emailed me actually looked over their caesarian-section bill. |
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| EricB | It's driving OBs out of business |
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| pashdown | They found a box of alcohol wipes for $60. |
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| pashdown | Go ahead gthornock |
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| kevin | e.g. http://www.factcheck.org/article133.html |
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| gthornock | Malpractice seems like a small portion of the medical cost issue, but it is enough to drive doctors, especially ObGyn and psychiatrists, out of private practice and into the corporate medical system. They just can't afford to go it alone. |
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| kevin | . |
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| pashdown | Good point. I think its a contributing factor, but I want to hear from more people to understand it fully. |
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| pashdown | kevin? |
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| pashdown | They're breaking out the glow ropes here. |
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| pashdown | I should have brought a webcam. |
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| kevin | how can we prevent "them" from making such ridiculous charges? the kleenex box is the cheapest, thinnest, most inexpensive they can get, for example, but then they charge so much |
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| EricB | ? |
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| pashdown | My fear is that by regulating the cost of kleenex in a hospital, they'll cut into something else. |
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| pashdown | I'd like to know how profitable for-profit hospitals are. |
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| kevin | I suppose that needs to be up to the citizens to revolt over their $60 wipes |
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| kevin | ..class action, whatever |
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| pashdown | I've heard mixed stories on how well county hospitals work too. |
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| kevin | my largest issue with healthcare this year is constant billing problems, like partially paying a claim once I've already reached max out-of-pocket |
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| pashdown | what do you think the cause is? |
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| kevin | as a pessimist on this topic, I suspect it's intentional |
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| kevin | however, it's entirely possible they are just broken |
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| bcs | I work in a hospital and I think its more about the $60 box of alcohol wipes than malpractice money. Hospitals are inefficient, one piece of equipment I use I could recklessly charge twice as much for running the same test and no one would be the wiser. |
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| EricB | ? |
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| pashdown | what about excessive testing? |
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| pashdown | sorry, its a bit chaotic here now |
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| EricB | What about trying help define a unified digital medical records format so that they can all trade info easily instead of the huge amount of paper waste they create? (to help reduce costs) |
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| pashdown | thats an example of efficiencies through technology. The question is whether it will make much of an impact. |
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| EricB | think about the amount of stamps it will save. |
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| EricB | along with emailing instead of letters |
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| kevin | assuming that poor soul who has a pile of collections 2" high can afford email anymore |
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| EricB | online billing like my car insurance would be nice too |
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| EricB | also having a unified records format would help reduce errors, hence mis diagnosis, wrongs tests, etc |
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| bcs | oh yes excessive testing happens but its a grey area, you can't say oh no, you don't need that test to a patient or they think they are losing their level of care. So you test them for whatever they want and bill it to insurance. |
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| EricB | ya, more psychs in the hospitals to get rid of the hypocondriacts (sp?) |
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| pashdown | Eric, the question then is asked about patient privacy, however I think records can be digitally keyed for that concern. |
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| gthornock | . |
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| pashdown | go ahead |
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| EricB | well what does the DMV do with all your info? same with any company, it has to be encrypted |
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| pashdown | Talking about digital keys to most legislators is like talking about alien technology. |
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| gthornock | Patient privacy would be a significant concern with a unified records format, but it's a significant concern /now/, too, and not just in the medical profession. Improved data protection and privacy practices are needed in every business that uses technology. |
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| EricB | HIPPA and Sarbanes-Oxley are all up and going now to "help" with that. |
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| gthornock | The improved protections could be -- should be -- designed into a unified records format from the beginning. |
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| EricB | Yes I agree |
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| gthornock | HIPAA may help somewhat in the medical profession. I don't see Sarbanes doing a thing about privacy. |
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| pashdown | Brought to you by Microsoft :-) |
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| EricB | a method to reliably digitally "sign" them |
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| kevin | . |
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| pashdown | go ahead |
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| kevin | Perhaps I'm not looking hard enough, but I have yet to find a study or media report about exactly why premiums have gone up 10%+ per year since 2001, or so. Where _are_ these increasing costs? |
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| kevin | ..the insurance companies know |
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| pashdown | I've heard administrative costs have gone up 2500% over the past 10 years. |
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| * kevin/#pashdown double-takes |
| EricB | How'd they manage that? |
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| pashdown | Lack of oversight i'd guess |
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| kevin | I would like to see some sort of real oversight. |
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| kevin | If other essential services, such as power and telco, have escaped total deregulation, why not get someone auditing ... oh that'll just drive up costs again :) |
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| EricB | I think it's time for a re-organization thing, and integration with modern technology |
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| pashdown | Transparency would help significantly |
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| kevin | ? -- new topic |
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| pashdown | go ahead |
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| kevin | regulation of voip, your stand? |
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| kevin | ..also how that applies to current telco regulations |
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| pashdown | I think its impossible. |
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| pashdown | Regulate voip and it will become something else. |
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| pashdown | IM voice for example. |
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| pashdown | Wrapped in encoding |
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| kevin | last october, powell@fcc promised to put VoIP under federal control, saying the industry needed federal oversight and lax regulations to flourish. how would you oppose such actions? |
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| kevin | I misparsed 'lax' as 'tax' as I was probing news |
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| pashdown | The only thing I could do is demonstrate how fruitless it would be. |
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| EricB | . |
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| pashdown | go ahead |
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| EricB | Unfortunately most of the Senators up there wouldn't understand. |
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| EricB | (if you demonstrated) |
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| pashdown | I think I'm pretty good at putting things in laymans' terms, but its optimistic to think that everyone would understand it immediately. |
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| kevin | Maybe Powell wasn't so bad, he "\u201cbelieves unflinchingly in maintaining an Internet free from government regulation\u201d and that "IP-based services such as VoIP should evolve in a regulation-free zone." |
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| kevin | oh lousy pasting |
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| pashdown | I hope that other techies will get involved. |
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| EricB | Linksys is preparing a wifi phone for skype |
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| pashdown | Wish it would do SIP |
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| kevin | there are a half dozen good wifi sip phones |
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| EricB | well with linksys a lot of their stuff runs linux, so..... |
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| pashdown | How much? |
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| kevin | $200 range and up |
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| EricB | the linksys one is aiming for $100 |
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| pashdown | Be nice to have one that does regular wireless phone too. |
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| kevin | wow. slashdot just linked a zyxel review, however I hear through the developer community that they are no good |
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| kevin | pash, there are some. they are expensive. see moto mpx and perhaps one other moto model that's gsm + wifi |
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| kevin | uniden has a phone too |
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| kevin | (sip/wifi only though) |
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| EricB | ? |
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| EricB | Is XM limiting or controlling what services can be accessed on the public wifi spots? |
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| pashdown | one sec |
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| Web635 | ? |
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| pashdown | Eric go ahead |
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| pashdown | one second |
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| kevin | eric, I believe p2p stuff is being severely shaped |
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| pashdown | We limit one access to one hour for non-subscribers |
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| pashdown | Although you can just sign in again. |
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| pashdown | There are also limits on SMTP ports and such to prevent spamming and abuse. |
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| EricB | so no voip/sip? |
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| kevin | nat is an issue there |
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| pashdown | Because its behind NAT, you'll have to deal with that. |
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| kevin | but no reason it can't work with the right nat helper proxy or tunnel |
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| EricB | Ya we're geeky :-)\ |
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| kevin | I intend to work from gallivan one afternoon, using a softphone on my laptop :) |
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| pashdown | Sorry if I'm slow to respond. Lots of people coming up and talking to me. |
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| bcs | I hope those of us coming from less techie parts of Utah can hang in for the techie talk. Cause whoa, like I totally have no idea what yer talkin about half the time. |
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| bcs | ;) |
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| pashdown | Ha ha |
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| EricB | We just naturally go down those paths, it's like walking downhill |
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| EricB | Ask a question then and change the subject :-) |
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| bcs | No really, thank you/ XMission for the WiFi, its so generous and forward thinking! |
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| kevin | eric, I'm working on a nat proxy. I'll see about adding it to the wifi gateway |
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| pashdown | Its working well tonight. |
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| EricB | :-) c'mon throw in come aycronyms for us! |
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| kevin | the ppl at dc req'd 8 srt subs after ort was qed. passing nvt, cts hooked the drop to the ap and set the ip and mac. arp worked. |
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| EricB | sheesh |
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| * kevin/#pashdown mutes self |
| pashdown | Very nice. |
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| [innards] | hahaha |
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| * gthornock/#pashdown laughs |
| * kevin/#pashdown files a report |
| EricB | PCMCIA = People Can't Remember Computer Industry Acronyms |
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| kevin | amen |
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| EricB | oops, Memorize |
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| [innards] | pashdown, do you think we'll need gov't regs to protect consumers from id theft / cc theft, or will the industry regulate itself with PCI and other standards? |
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| pashdown | Wait |
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| pashdown | I think thats trying to regulate burglary |
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| pashdown | The industry would have to put better measures in place or its going to hit their bottom lines. |
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| pashdown | Doesn't most ID theft happen in garbage cans too? |
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| EricB | I shred |
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| [innards] | heh, true |
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| bcs | i shred too |
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| kevin | how about companies need you to opt-in to share your personal data with others, rather than you needing to opt-out? do you share that view? |
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| [innards] | it's already a federal crime to steal mail, not sure how much that is working as a deterrent for id theft |
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| gthornock | There is something to be said for requiring better data protection practices, but that may not need to be legislated. It may just come down to liability for negligence. |
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| bcs | amen to innards |
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| Odeezy | ? |
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| pashdown | wait |
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| bcs | Pete this is when any good politician has his wife fill in, we'll never no. |
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| kevin | webcam :) |
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| pashdown | Ok, go ahead Odeezy |
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| Odeezy | Hi pete, how do you feel about hate crime legislation? |
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| pashdown | Mostly that is a state matter. I support the idea though. |
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| kevin | ? |
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| pashdown | Go ahead Kevin |
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| kevin | Do you think we should be onboard with the Kyoto treaty? |
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| pashdown | Having visited Kyoto last year, I was intimate with the kind of climate change they are experiencing there. Like a ten degree shift in the last 20 years. |
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| pashdown | I think the US needs to find an energy source which is cheap, clean, and plentiful. |
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| pashdown | The current energy bill pussyfoots around alternative energy sources. I don't understand the hesitation to actually do something. |
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| kevin | fusion sounds good. are you informed about the explosive possibilities of a fusion chain reactor? |
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| pashdown | The Hoover dam was built in 5 years and I keep wondering if I'll see anything but coal & oil in my lifetime. |
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| pashdown | A fusion reactor can be bombed and it goes out like a candle. |
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| pashdown | It has a very short fuel supply, where a fission reactor has a very long fuel supply. |
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| kevin | so no H-bomb. |
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| pashdown | I realize we're contributing to ITER financially, but I think the US should be pushing with all its got to find a new fuel source aside from hydrocarbons. |
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| EricB | ? |
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| pashdown | No H-bomb, no radiation, no large amounts of waste looking for a reservation. |
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| pashdown | Go ahead Eric |
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| EricB | What about biofuels? |
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| kevin | history channel had a bit on nuclear tech and fusion reactors. do you know if we have anything other than weapons research here in us? |
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| kevin | (I was late, I'll wait) |
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| pashdown | I've heard mixed reports on biofuels. Like it takes more energy to make them than it produces. |
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| gthornock | . |
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| pashdown | Go ahead gt |
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| pashdown | Ethanol plants are big polluters too. |
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| gthornock | It seems like we need more than one cheap, clean, plentiful energy source. Nuclear may be a great way to go for electricity, but it's not very portable. For transportation, ethanol or biodiesel may well be a good way to go, at least in the short term. Longer term, something like fuel cells might work better. |
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| pashdown | Kevin, I don't know how much fusion/fission research is going on here. I think China and India are doing a lot more. |
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| kevin | France is funding a possible commercial-use reactor, is that correct? |
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| pashdown | If we use superconductors for rebuilding the grid, we have the energy pipeline right there. If the electricity is cheap, then splitting water into hydrogen isn't that much of an issue. Hydrogen then goes into the fuel-cell engines. |
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| kevin | ..would you support/propose research funds to build one? |
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| pashdown | Kevin, that is ITER. Its still only research. The subsequent DEMO reactor is supposed to be commercial. |
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| kevin | ah ok |
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| pashdown | Yes, I would. |
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| EricB | There is a superconducing power cable from canada to michigan i think |
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| kevin | there's also neato high voltage switching gear that can pack more on existing wires |
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| pashdown | Not only that, but a Utah company, Ceramatech specifically does superconductor and fuel-cell research. |
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| pashdown | Imagine undersea superconductor "pipelines" rather than oil shipping. |
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| pashdown | I think we're on the encore on the stage here. |
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| kevin | it's really the only way we can keep our consuming car culture, which the rest of the developing world wants too. |
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| kevin | ? |
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| pashdown | Public adoption is driven by cheaper alternatives. The only way to get to a cheaper alternative than oil is to put the effort into research. I really don't think we're that far away from workable cheap energy. |
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| pashdown | Go ahead Kevin |
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| kevin | there's a bunch of pork in this latest transportation bill. what would your pork be for utah? |
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| pashdown | hah |
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| EricB | oink oink |
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| kevin | well, you are representing us, right? we like pork. :) |
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| pashdown | There is a pressing need for highway rebuilding and expansion all over the state. I'd also like to see some work on solar farms/chimneys done in our remote deserts. |
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| kevin | just like alaska likes a bridge to nowhere.. utah doesn't. |
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| [innards] | hey, we have natural land bridges ;) |
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| kevin | how about trax/commuter rail? what do you think you could do to move that along? |
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| bcs | good topic |
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| pashdown | Good infrastructure like fast rail, and I'm talking like 250 mph and not 70 mph (which is planned for Utah) would be essential for rural revitalization. |
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| bcs | what's the cost on that? |
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| EricB | nice chatting tonight Pete, night. |
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| pashdown | wait |
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| Web918 | Pete, thanks for your thoughts, I have to get up early... by |
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| pashdown | adios |
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| pashdown | bcs, probably a zillion dollars |
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| pashdown | Amtrak needs a huge overhaul though. |
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| pashdown | I'm going to wrap things up for tonight. Thanks everyone. |
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| bcs | Thanks |
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| IRC log ended Thu Aug 11 22:03:05 2005 |